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Wanting to boost dBs... how?

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Wanting to boost dBs... how?

Postby Cassini on Wed Apr 11, 2012 7:10 pm

Ok, i want to increase the output of my amphead, I imagine something like a phono stage, between amp and cab that will simply boost decible but wont affect the tone/nuances of the head..
Any ideas?
Let me know if you dont understand what im getting at if need be....
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Postby tommygunner on Sat Apr 14, 2012 11:11 pm

Hi,

Perhaps something reasonably straightforward like adding an extra speaker cab could help??

Perhaps add some kind of preamp??

Probably a pedal out there that will boost without distorting, if you are looking for a louder clean sound.

You could always ask someone at the RS, problem is they may try to sell you some silly substitute!!

Anyway, good luck and I hope this helps!!

Cheers,Cg :)
...and let there be tremolo!!!
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Postby Cassini on Sun Apr 15, 2012 11:51 am

Nice, thanks man.
As far as i know, i can run another cab, sending me from 80w to an incredible 110w, solid state..
though for the sake of not havng to carry extra cabs id prefer the preamp option, do you know of anything eg, manufacturer/model numbers in particuar?
After silence, that which comes nearest to expressing the inexpressible is music.
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Postby tommygunner on Sun Apr 15, 2012 10:06 pm

Hi,

I am not really an expert and I am guessing your a bassist??

I have had a quick look on Ebay for stuff that could sit on top of your rig....plenty of expensive preamps that would probably do the job and will also add some nice valve tones....but there are also some more economical pedals that would also do the job {I think!!} and you could get a bargain if you look into it and shop around..

eg The Eden World Tour WTDI Bass Direct Box Preamp Pedal....looks to me like something that would help.

I hope this helps or if I am talking nonsense I hope someone else can step in and give you sound advice!!

Good Luck!!

Cheers,Cg :)
...and let there be tremolo!!!
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Postby Dreich on Mon Apr 16, 2012 11:58 pm

If you have a separate amp head and speaker cab and you want to increase db without overly effecting the tone you have these options:

1) Increase the efficiency of the speaker(s) - replace the existing speaker(s) with ones which convert the watts (power) your amp is supplying into more volume (dB). Speaker efficiency is given as dB per Watt in the specs.

2) Use a speaker with less resistance (Ohms) (ie 4 instead of 8 ). This WILL increase the dB but YOU HAVE TO MAKE SURE YOUR AMP CAN DRIVE THE LOWER LOAD. This will be in the amplification specs. If you get it wrong the amp can go bang and hilariously set itself on fire...

3) Attach two cabs to the amplifier: this in effect is the same as (2). Again YOU MUST check the amp can drive the lower resistance (ohms) supplied by two linked cabinets or bang! fire, and smoke (a good stage effect but not entirely conducive to a long playing career).

4) If it is a valve amplifier upgrade the output valves to a higher output - best speak to Bob Field about this.

5) Run a second power amp and speaker(s) from the 'pre-amp' out on your amplifier.

Adding a pre-amp to your current setup will change the tone and 'overdrive' the inputs to the pre-amp that already exists on your current amplifier, plus, your amplifier has a limited output and your current speaker a limited power handling - sticking more 'up-it' isn't going to make it moan any 'louder' (that's what she said:-) Or it might for a wee while, but we're soon back to the bang! smoke and fire scenario...

Now, if you or you audience are having trouble hearing your amp, there are simple things to try -
Unless it's the crappiest amp ever an 80W guitar amp should be heard easily in most gigs, [fork], I've had 80W guitar amps overpower a 5k PA system - try:

1) Getting the amp of the floor: point it at ears, not, as seems to be the fashion, at knees.
2) Think about how your tone fits in with the band - if everyone sits in a unique(ish) tone range instruments aren't fighting for the same space and are easily heard.
3) Try some compression (a cheap Boss type pedal is all you need).

Finally:

Don't confuse 'huge' sound with 'loud' - they're not the same thing - huge can quiet, weak can be loud....

Cheers.....
an un-soundengineer
http://www.livesoundengineering.com

...allergic to Perrier, daylight and responsibility...
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Postby Cassini on Tue Apr 17, 2012 7:59 pm

concise and to the point, brilliant! thanks to you both.
and yes, it isnt a matched head/cab, im running 4 rocket 50's/50w at 8ohm, i have another cab of 2 sheffields 75w at 8ohm also, the old gal (96 trace elliot supertramp 80w) can handle 4ohm. ill hook that up and give it a whirl.. unless my understanding that 2x8ohm=4ohm is incorrect.. ill await a relpy there just to be sure.
ps, im from an acoustic background so im sure ill have pleanty more questions to come..
After silence, that which comes nearest to expressing the inexpressible is music.
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Postby Dreich on Tue Apr 17, 2012 9:00 pm

If the speakers are wired in parallel the impedance lowers:

Za= impedance of speaker 1, Zb of speaker 2.

Zt = (Za x Zb) / (Za + Zb)
Zt = (8 x 8) / (8 + 8)
Zt = 64 / 16
Zt = 4 ohms

Which is great, as your amp handle that.

If the speakers are wired in series the impedance raises:
Zt = Za + Zb
Zt = 8 + 8
Zt = 16 ohms

Too large an impedance at the amplifier is no way near as big a problem as too low - it will normally just result in a weaker and quieter output so...

Give it a whirl with 2 cabs - if it's louder, all good. If it's quieter look at how the links are wired....
an un-soundengineer
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...allergic to Perrier, daylight and responsibility...
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Postby Cassini on Fri May 11, 2012 9:00 pm

Yep, the extra cab thing was an undeniable inprovement..
as was removing rackmount effects thinger...
Mmmmm tone... tone with volume too....
Thanks a plenty gentlemen.
After silence, that which comes nearest to expressing the inexpressible is music.
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Postby scurvydog on Fri May 18, 2012 1:37 am

Wow, I thought bass players just plug into a big amp or DI and play 'E' and say "sweet". I live and learn.
'They'll hang me in the morning....
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Postby Cassini on Fri May 18, 2012 6:59 pm

Ah, the Trace Elliot amp may throw many to beleive im a bassist..
But nope, this is back when Trace did guitar gear, before Gibson bought their guitar stuff, then i think peavey managed to drive them further into the ground..

if interested.. http://www.stratconnection.com/apps/pho ... d=10579377

If more interested, No. Not for sale..

Regardless, i still love playing E through big amps Scurvy haha
After silence, that which comes nearest to expressing the inexpressible is music.
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